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Hi there, I have a question about this rule, Im running a mid 80s toyota surf that has the factory fitted laminated glass sunroof, do i need to replace this with a bit of alloy or is it ok as is?
Cheers
[Modified by: Tim Fensom on 08 January 2009 18:20:13 ]

Hi Tim, in one of the early winch challenge events we had a Nissan roll over with a sun roof and the occupants heads broke through the glass. I admit at that time we were only requiring lap/diagonal seatbelts.
That was one reason to require a roof that would not shatter, thus the rule.

Peter

What rule are you referring to Peter? I didn't think there was a "no glass sunroofs" rule. I've just had a look through the rules and couldn't find any mention of sunroofs.

Pete Weatherly had a rule along those lines for his event after the incident Peter mentioned, but as far as I can remember, we've never added such a rule to our rules.

Jeremy, it's that same rule although it does not specifically refer to sun roofs, but the principle is to ensure that there is a solid, non-shattering barrier as a roof. I don't think any competition vehicles have had, or been allowed to compete with glass panels in the roof since, but I may be wrong.
I would not allow a glass panel in a roof if I was an event organiser. I'm sure it would not be difficult or expensive to replace the glass with a metal panel and it could be changed back if desired at a later time.

As Peter has said, it has nothing to do with sunroofs and you can have a sunroof as long as it is permanently in place. It is to do with having an unpenatrable barrier above you head. One way is to take the glass out and replace with poly carb. Then it is clear (shaded) and can still open for ventilation but won't shatter.

There have been trucks run factory sunroofs (2005 Kiwi and against the rules!) that have rolled and broken the sunroof that then showered glass all over the occupants. Not something you want to happen.

Also you can push the rules to the limit if you want, but be advised that if you don't comply or interpret something wrong, you won't race! "I thought" will not be a valid excuse! So keep asking questions and get the 'right' answers, as that is what this forum is all about.

The only rule that refers to roofing only applies to "soft-top, plastic, or open top vehicles" (rule 18.2). Tim's car isn't any of those and so his sunroof is fine under our current rules.

I know there are quite a few people who think there is a "no sunroof" rule, but it's just another one of those many misconception's.

Having said all that, we require roof protection for those other vehicle type, so to be fair we should probably apply this rule to sunroofs on hard-top vehicles as well - a possible rule change to consider next time around.

My interpretation is that a sunroof that opens means it is an open top vehicle. There is no mention of how much it must be open or covered etc so ANY opening means it must comply with this rule.
Lets get the committee to discuss this and report back ASAP.
[Modified by: Darin Neeley on January 13, 2009 11:47 AM]

Will you have a decision before the norwest comp?
It doesnt matter if i have to change it, BUT - im not going to change it, if i dont have too.
As Peter said rules have changed quite a bit since when you had problems, i.e. a full cage would stop the roof deforming and placing some of the stress on the roof that may shatter it.
Also we now have to run harnesses that should hope fully keep you head in the vechicle at all times.
Also ive seen a few sunroofs out of surfs that have been rolled, and the sunroof has usually stayed intact, which couldnt be said for the door glass and the windscreens.

Hi Tim
This has highlighted loop hole in the rules and the intention is to clarify it so that 18.2 covers sunroofs as well. So in your case the safest thing to do is replace the sunroof with a material that comply's with 18.2. This rule isn't about the roof calapsing, it is about a something penetrating it in a roll over.
There will be a statement issued that informs of a change to rule for 2010 and there will be a suplimantary rule added to cover us until then.
It will be up to the event organisers this year whether they applied this ruling but if I was you, I would assume that they will

Fair enough, thanks for the response
Its pretty much what i thought would happen.